201: A Black Entrepreneur’s Guide to Navigating the Alcohol & Spirits Industry w/ Dia Simms & Erin J. Hall of Pronghorn

Erin:
It’s really one of those things where we have to embed the narrative of we belong, you know, from a founder perspective, but also from an internal intrapreneurial perspective where talent black executives have a place in the spirits industry. We have a different perspective from our community, which has basically consumed and led culture with all of these spirits brands in some kind of way. When you think about how Hennessy was built, when you think about how Ciroc was built, when you think about all of these brands and how we show up, it’s almost, you know, we belong here. We’ve been building these brands for years, but we haven’t been able to create wealth and legacy around the profits of these brands. And so when we came up with the concept of all black bar, it was one of those things where we’re proud that the full bar, whether it’s a whiskey, whether it’s a gin, whether it’s a vodka, it’s here. And it’s created and made for black people and by black people.

Monique:
You’re listening to the black to business podcast, an educational podcast providing black entrepreneurs with the tools and resources to start and grow their businesses. We chat with vetted black entrepreneurs, thought leaders and business owners as they provide tips and resources to help take your.

Monique:
Business to the next level.

Monique:
I’m your host, Mooney T. Marshalle.

Monique:
Hey, hey. Welcome back to the Black to Business podcast. I’m your host Monique T. Marshall. And today we’re diving into a super exciting and important topic, the spirit and alcohol industry. Even though we black Americans are major consumers and trendsetters in this space, we’re still pretty underrepresented. Can you believe that we make up only about 7% of the industry’s talent pool, despite being 15% of the population? That is why it’s so crucial for us to get more involved, tackle the unique challenges that we might face and seize the big opportunities that are out there. And I’m so excited to introduce to you our amazing guest today, Erin J.

Monique:
Harris and DSMs. These two have done it all from event planning and talent booking to hospitality and working on major spirit brands like Saurophe and Deleon. They teamed up to launch Mobile 1707 tequila and didnt stop there. They started Pronghorn, an accelerated program thats all about bringing more diversity into the spirits industry. By investing in black owned brands, Pronghorn offers not just financial support, but also education, mentorship and partnerships with industry leaders. Their goal is to drive 2.4 billion of economic value over the next ten years and boost black representation in the industry, Pronghard has created a blueprint for diversifying industries by focusing on black entrepreneurs and leaders. With backing from global beverage giant Diageo, which committed $200 million to support their mission, Pronghorn is making wave. With this innovative and commercial four approach, Erin and Dia will walk us through the essential steps to get your spirits business off the ground, how to make your brand stand out, and why finding your niche is such a big deal.

Monique:
Plus, we’ll chat about the importance of partnerships, emerging tech trends, and navigating the production and distribution side of things. So whether you’re curious about the spirits industry or looking to break into it, this episode is packed with insightful advice that will help you understand and succeed in this industry. So grab your favorite drink, get a little comfy, and let’s dive in.

Monique:
Erin and Dia, welcome to the Black to Business podcast. I am really hyped to have you both here, so welcome to the Black to Business podcast show.

Dia:
Oh, thank you so much. We are delighted to be here. I love a good podcast, but I do miss that we can’t be having a nice glass of whiskey or something together.

Erin:
That’s when in person is much better.

Monique:
I am in agreement. We getting there. We’re getting there. But I’m so glad to have you both here. And before we dive into today’s topic, which is all about a black entrepreneur’s guide to navigating the alcohol and spirits industry, I want to get my audience familiar with who you both are. Cause you all are some powerhouses, and I would love for you to share a little bit of your journey. How did you get here in your background?

Erin:
Well, it’s so funny. Cause Dia and I always joke about how our paths are really, really similar. We both went to school in the DMV, the DC, Maryland, Virginia area, and we kind of worked in the same space in event planning and booking talent and kind of working with one of the best hospitality engineers in the DC area. And then from there, I went to work with Sean John, and Dia was already there working for combs enterprises. I worked in fashion, and that’s kind of what I always wanted to do. I thought I was a fashionist, which is funny because I went to school for finance at Howard. So hu of here. Yes, yes.

Erin:
And somehow, some way, I was like, I’m not gonna end up being an investment banker. So let me figure out how I could pivot, wanted to do fashion, and then from there, it was kind of a perfect harmony where the Ciroc brand was coming to fruition, and they had been working, Dia had been working on it for a while just to get the deal done with Diageo. And she kind of came to me and said, do you want to work on this with me? And I was excited. So, yes, that kind of, like, started our spirits industry experience, if you will. And so we did that for a while. We grew that brand and it was a very exciting journey. I also worked on other brands like Boli, like Bakas with Fergie and Pitbull, as well as mix with Nicki Minaj and Mona Scott Young. So that was super exciting.

Erin:
And then kind of came back to Dia and worked with her on daily own. And that’s where we kind of really saw, like, the industry, the spirits industry, and the need for an entity like pronghorn just understanding the dynamics and understanding where black, the black community was as far as founders and as far as kind of getting the respect and getting the attention needed on the distributor side and the supplier side. So that was also interesting for us. And then we both obviously went to Lobos and now we’re here with Pronghorn. Excited.

Monique:
Yes. By the way, I’m just like over here, like fangirling, because I am offending you both in all the work years. And shout out to Hu Winter Howard as well. So love it.

Erin:
Setting the foundation, setting the foundation budget.

Monique:
DNl’s to come.

Dia:
So the other incredible HBCU down the road from Howard was Morgan State University. I had an incredible experience there. And coming out of it, actually, my kind of first real job was working for the Department of Defense, negotiating defense contracts. And it’s worth mentioning because, of course, I didn’t probably realize how critically important it was at that time. But being sent to the defense acquisition university and being trained in negotiations in terms of like, here’s your suite of tools. Depending on who you’re dealing with, these are the different ways and so forth. You know, at the time, it was interesting, probably a tad bit boring quietly, but, you know, almost, almost 30 years later, that foundation, so handy in everything I do, whether it’s with my husband, $100 million deal, or negotiating with my eleven year old, it was just a critical foundation. And from there, Erin’s right.

Dia:
We are, our path really mirrored. I think, you know, was more than serendipity when, you know, supposed to be in each other’s lives. She’s the best business partner work life out. So we kind of crossed paths and worked with the same impresario, gentleman named Mark Barnes, out of the Washington, DC area, who was just like a school in. How do you throw a beautiful event? How do you care deeply in what requires true, true hosting? Right, like the hostings and the details services in, through every experience, the temperature, the room, the sensory, the cocktails, the food, etcetera. So that was another, you know, we went to a great HBCU and then we got school again at different times, by the way, working for Mark.

Monique:
Yeah.

Dia:
And did a ton of stuff in sales, essentially. I started a small. My first kind of entree into the spirits industry was also in the DC area. Basically got like 30 of my homegirls and then got a negotiated a deal with seagrams, which at the time used to be in spirits. And I booked deals for us to do sampling. So if you’ve ever gone into a restaurant or a bar or spirit store and someone, oh, would you like to try this again? Would you like to try this? That’s essentially what I. We trained, we booked, and that was my kind of first experience in the industry. And then fast forward to work in New York for a hip hop radio station.

Dia:
And I inherited all the music labels as clients. So back then I had the Def jams of the world, the Atlantic of the world and so forth. I had bad boy records who at the time refused to actually advertise on the station because they were so loyal to what is like the kind of original global hip hop station called Hot 97 to break them, convince them. And I think we developed such a rapport, they said, hey, you want to come over and consider coming on in the Sean Colms office to work as his chief of staff? So took that interview, quick interview, got the job as executive assistant, not as chief of staff, because there was a. So you hadn’t really managed large teams before, but came in Fiddlesticks, October 5, 2005, and then was able to kind of rise through the ranks together with Aaron, from starting as an executive assistant to eventually becoming the first president of the company. And then Erin and I, after leaving combs a few years back, we worked together to launch a brand called Lobo 1707 Tequila with incredible founder from Spain and Diego and the backing of just luminaries like LeBron James and Orange Schwarzenegger. We built that brand through incredible momentum in the last couple of years. Really proud of the work there.

Dia:
And then our baby promo, which is what we’re really here to talk about today.

Monique:
Yes, such an incredible story.

Dia:
Journey.

Monique:
Love all the things. And like I said, been knowing about you both for years, so it’s so phenomenal to have you here and the perfect people to talk today about what we’re discussing, and I just want to talk more about the work that you are doing at Pronghorn. So just tell the listeners what is it that you do and kind of what the mission is.

Dia:
Yeah, so I’ll start. So we set up Pronghorn as, really a template on how to effectively diversify any industry. Right. So as the company went through a bit of a racial reckoning a few years ago, I think the thing we felt was so missing was, you know, how. What. How we get into wealth generation, how we get into economic. The right economic engineering policies in place so that communities can unlock their own futures and solve their own problems. But how do we fix the why more than the how? And then we said, we want to start this with the spirits industry, where there is meaningful underrepresentation, and we want to start with the black american community.

Dia:
Right? So we built out a methodology and a model and a platform that, over ten years, drives $2.4 billion of economic value through investing in black owned founders, entrepreneurs. Our plan is to invest in 57. We’re very proud to have now invested in 23 black owned brands. And Erin’s brainchild, if you’re desirous to, you can have an all black bar, your restaurant. And then we’re also driving intrapreneurship. Right. The gap, the probate gap, to get to an equivalent amount of a pro rata amount of black Americans in the industry is bringing in 1800 net gain new employees in the industry over ten years. And we have already seen a 5% lift black Americans in the industry to work that we’re doing together with HBCUs and great organizations like the National association of Black Accountants and so forth.

Dia:
And we’re really. We’re really proud about the. About having a tight kind of case study that we’re starting with the spirits industry, but any industry could use it.

Erin:
Also, I’ll piggyback off of that diA, because I think a big piece of this. When you hone in on the spirits industry and the black community, what we found through a number of our efforts with HBCUs and talent recruitment and engagement and building. Building the pipeline that DEA spoke about, it’s really one of those things where we have to embed the narrative of we belong means, you know, from a founder perspective, but also from an internal intrapreneurial perspective, where talent black executives have a place in the spirits industry. We have a different perspective from our community, which has basically consumed and led culture with all of these spirits brands. In some kind of way, when you think about how Hennessy was built. When you think about how Ciroc was built, when you think about all of these brands and how we show up, it’s almost, you know, we belong here. We’ve been building these brands for years, but we haven’t been able to create wealth and legacy around the profits of these brands. And so when we came up with the concept of all black bar, it was one of those things where we’re proud that the full bar, whether it’s a whiskey, whether it’s a gin, whether it’s a vodka, it’s here and it’s created in a.

Erin:
For black people and by black people. One of the things that happened, I want to say in February, I guess it was around red carpet month, and Ava Duvernay’s team came to me. She was doing an event during red carpet season for the film industry, and she wanted Pronghorn to kind of be her bar. And it was obviously all of these black owned brands. But then when I looked at her guest list, it was literally the general market movers and shakers from Leonardo DiCaprio to XYZ producer. And so I kind of took a step back, like, oh, wow. Like, we’re going to literally have an all black bar at this function that’s going to be pretty much a white function, you know? And so, you know, I had to say to myself, like, that’s where we belong. It’s not.

Erin:
It’s supposed to be the norm. It’s right now, you know, we’re trying to make the exception and we’re trying to really find our place in these different events and at the bars and at these accounts, et cetera. But it really should be the norm where, you know, these are black browns that you could easily find and you can pull and make cocktails, etcetera.

Monique:
Yeah, I love that so much. And it’s like you all are setting that tone, but we’re still in the moment where you have to still recognize that we aren’t there yet. But what you all are doing is so phenomenal because it’s like you are helping it lead the norm. I want to take a step back and really talk about really understanding the spirit industry and where black people, black entrepreneurs and executives are currently. So what is the state of the spirit industry as it relates to black entrepreneurs and executives?

Erin:
So when we look at the industry as a whole, what we know is that 15% of the population is the black community, and we’ve been consuming these brands for years. But when we look at the talent that exists in that space, it’s at about 7%. So our role is to kind of close that gap as we recruit and as we find a pipeline of black talent, and then also create a path that can retain that talent through programming, through a mutual understanding, through building community within this three tier system where we have the supplier, the distributor, and the retailer platform. And so I think that the state is definitely improving. And as Dia said, you know, when we first started this project, but, I mean, we’ve invested in 23 black owned brands, but when we first started this initiative, there was a lot of concern around, well, there aren’t many black owned brands. We can’t find black owned brands to invest in. So before Pronghorn even kicked off, we did a ton of due diligence. We did research, we talked to everybody that we know, and we ended up compiling a list of 106 black owned brands.

Erin:
And that was three years ago. Now, it’s probably, you know, it’s probably upwards of 300 to 400 black owned brands that we’ve discovered in our path in conversations working with the current founders that we have and their body of network and people that they. That they work with. So I think, you know, having an ecosystem and creating that conversation and narrative that says, like, who’s out there that we know that we can support? Who can we help with? Not just the dollars from Pronghorn to invest in the brands, but also the supercharging. And the supercharging is a piece where we come in, and I saw kind of on your platform, you talk a lot about how to, like, stand a business up from, like, the ground level. And that’s what a lot of these black businesses need. They need to understand the finance behind it, the marketing behind it, the P and ls, the profit margins, how we can better use our leverage, supply contacts. And so we come in and with the help of our anchor supplier, I mean, our anchor investor, Diageo, we work with them on really trying to reinforce all of the different elements that are much needed in this very difficult spirits industry, because this is really hard to push through as a general brand, but especially as a black owned brand that doesn’t really have a foothold on the anchor or foundation of the business.

Monique:
Yes, and, Erin, I’m so glad you mentioned that and the reality that we’re at right now. And I want to talk about those specific challenges or opportunities that existed for those who are thinking about getting into the industry. So for somebody who is thinking about getting into the spirits industry, what are some of those specific challenges or opportunities that exist and how do they navigate and establish themselves to be successful?

Dia:
One of the biggest challenges is, like, the regulatory environment versus other industries. The laws can just change, like, literally from zip code to zip code. So you can have a great idea and you can even have the capital, but you really do have to understand the laws. You have to truly understand the responsibility of being in a regulated industry and making sure that your product is getting in the right people’s hands that are as age appropriate. And you have to understand that, you know, there are, in this multi billion dollar industry, there’s about 80 brands that drive almost all of the revenue, which is pretty unusual compared to industries of our size, a lot more brands. But what that means is when you’re starting a brand new brand from scratch, you’re going up against some like, pretty monster brands that have big budgets and huge brand awareness. So understanding how do you break through the clutter, how do you help, you know, educate the consumer, even understand spirits is another piece of it. And the way we’ve tried to ameliorate some of those challenges is, as Erin described, really distilling.

Dia:
What are the categories of importance. So under supercharging, you have marketing or data or regulatory or working with a distributor, because you can’t actually, in most states, sell directly to a consumer.

Erin:
Right.

Dia:
So how do you manage getting your product out? Right. And those things that are just could be really overwhelming if you’re just, you could be the most brilliant founder. But everybody needs help. So we’ve established a team that have legitimately, like centuries experience who can help you with your plans. You have a cool idea, but you need a little capital, little seed capital to get your idea on paper, get a deck going, get some research. We can help with that. If you started your brand and you’re like, okay, I got it and I’m selling it at a couple restaurants in my neighborhood. But how do I make it bigger? How do I make it cost less to produce it? That we can say, oh, we can help you get your glass for cheaper.

Dia:
We can help you introduce you to a distributor. Like, the whole point is it’s not really going to work with us just handing out some generic, you know, PDF of advice. We really do provide bespoke solutions to the founder needs, but also just be a vault of information. People who are in the research stage through Plumbhorn Co.

Monique:
Yes, I love that. And you both in the beginning have shared all of your years of experience in this industry and such a plethora of knowledge that you have. I want to talk about some of the essential knowledge or expertise that people or entrepreneurs should possess when they are entering the spirit industry. So what are the essentials?

Erin:
Well, I wanted to tap into one of the things that Dia had mentioned around data as one of the supercharging pillars. I think one of the things as entrepreneurs, when we go into a space, half of the success depends on like the innovation and the instinct of the culture and what that trend looks like. But then the other half depends on the actual real firm statistical data of how the market is trending. You know, what are the different things that can factor into your business succeeding and or failing? What are the contributors that can ensure that your product to ds point breaks through? So I think that founders need to have a lot of information about the product, about industry, about the data of their consumer. They need to understand who they’re targeting, why they’re targeting, how much that person spends, what that spend is going to look like over the next ten to 15 years, so that they can create a forecast around what that product is going to do and how it’s going to disrupt. Which leads me into, you know, thinking big and thinking audaciously. So one of the things that Dee and I always challenge the team with is that how can we create something a that has never been done before and then, or something that has been done before, but in a new system that creates efficiencies or creates a better consumer journey, whoever where we’re marketing to or whoever we want to buy or invest in this product and or brand. So I think that that’s probably part two of it, that thinking so big.

Erin:
When you look at the tech industry and how some of these things have changed consumer lives, you know, how can we apply some of that thinking to building these brand, these brands? And I know when we first launched wronghorn, I was talking to my mother and I was telling her, like, wow, I think, like, this is really going to be my version of she’s a doctor, so, like, my version of what she’s been able to do, like in the, in the health field. And that’s to kind of level set the thinking. And so how can we apply that thought process to these individual brands and what they can do and how they can drive purpose into the community?

Monique:
So, yeah, that’s so good. And speaking of that, you mentioned technology and just innovation. I do want to talk about what emerging technologies or innovations do you both foresee shaping the future of this industry?

Dia:
Well, I think look on the tech side from what’s going on in AI. And this kind of answers both questions, right? One, any burgeoning entrepreneur, or even just acting like entrepreneur at your job, right? It’s so important to lean into the technologies and not lean away from them. Like I tell, I tell the story of, like I mentioned earlier, I used to be in radio sales working with the music industry. And I’ll never forget going from label to label. And you have to best and brightest base executives in these war rooms, spending tons and tons of time bringing in the brightest minds that everybody was focused on. How will we fight the Internet? I mean, this was a legit sound, so crazy, but everybody was like, yeah, we gonna do this? And how we gonna take it down? And what happened instead was the music industry lost millions of revenue for almost a decade trying to fight a futile fight. And now you just started to rebound. But how many jobs were lost during that time, right? Instead, when you see a new technology, frankly, first refrain from assessing what’s good or bad and lean into understanding, and you look at what’s happening right now.

Dia:
AI, it really should be a tool to democratize the everyday founder, to have the ability to move faster, to be more nimble, to develop your copy, to develop disruptive advertising on par with a major multinational in a way that didn’t exist 30 years ago. When you’re a small founder and it’s one of you, it’s five of you, you gotta use technology so you could, each one of you could be acting like five people so you can compete, you know, in a meaningful way. As in the second part of that question. From an innovation standpoint, our industry is actually relatively antiquated. And it’s an interesting industry because it’s just based on, like, six things, right? The bourbon of gin and tequila and so forth. Whereas there are thousands of, for example, fruit profiles all around the world, that in the United States, we don’t really lean into. We don’t lean into the deliciousness of lychee, right, or star food. Even fruits that we like are still kind of underutilized.

Dia:
Like a lovely pear is not getting the love it deserves, right? So there’s a lot of opportunity for flavor in a. There’s a lot of opportunity for packaging innovation. There’s also a lot of opportunity for being more local. You see, beer has done a better job of this than foolproof spirits of. How are you leaning into, like, the special nuances of where you’re from and in your state, in your city, to really show off a brand proposition in a way that I think is still a gap in our industry.

Monique:
That is so good. That is so, so good. Just all the things we don’t think about and leaning into these things and being above the competition or just getting ahead.

Erin:
I love it.

Monique:
So now I want to get into actually starting and scaling a spirits business, because on the blacks of business podcast, we like to break it down step by step. So, what are some of the foundation steps that entrepreneurs who are looking to get into this industry need to take? And how can prog horn’s approach support and nurture these black owned brands to contribute to their success?

Dia:
So I’ll say something quickly, and then, Aaron, jump in. But I would say first and first and first and first. Go walk. Go to, like, do the research, right? So I think we all. You could be in a cocoon, you know, by yourself or with your people, like, oh, my God, I got this incredible idea. But go walk the stores. Go crazy on the double cross Google search, right. And just try to find out a lot of information about what it exist.

Dia:
One, two. Once you do a lot of research in this industry, do research outside this industry. Well, what’s going in consumer. What’s Tropicana doing? Right. What’s Tropicana doing in China? Like, some things that are new to us have been going on for. They’ve been doing this in the Philippines for six decades. But you could take what they’re doing, add it to something we’re doing here, and figure out how you build your novel brand proposition. I think the second thing that’s so important is either get a good understanding of your financial needs or find the right resource that’s going to help you understand how to build and manage your p and l, right? So, like this idea, we sometimes we put a little too much weight on, oh, we got to talk about this money.

Dia:
It’s a lot of complexity around it, but every dollar, every day, every second, a dollar is getting spent, right. Just the way we prepare. Your dollars are going to be the skeleton of your brain, right? So if you had a chance to go, like, I’m gonna be building the clone, you actually have to build a skeleton, not just think about the eye shadow and the hairstyles and the outfits, right. What is? So, first and foremost, you have to get familiar with understanding how to build a manager P and L. And if that’s not your belly Wick, to figure out how you go to somebody, I’m creative. I can make the most. You never tasted a gym like this. But then the other person maybe has the prowess and like, okay, I’m an accounting expert.

Dia:
I’m gonna help you make sure we have this. And that way you can work together. But that is going to be mission critical. You have to. You have to know your numbers, because otherwise, it is not a business, it is a hobby.

Erin:
I will piggyback off of that. I think dia hit it on the head. But one of the things I would say is that what we find with founders is that sometimes they are so tied to the idea, the initial idea and concept, that once they start feedback, they’re not able to pivot and change and adjust. And the truth is, is that trends are moving so fast that products have to adjust to the pace. And so I think one of the things that founders could do better or think through is like how, where, and when they’re willing to evolve their brand or change their brand a little bit to meet the market needs to excel in a way that is, is profitable to them.

Monique:
That’s so good. That is true. We are, yeah, married to that. Early ideas.

Dia:
Yes.

Monique:
Y’all are hitting everything on the head today. So how does the current state of the spirits industry, particularly concerning black entrepreneurs and executives, influence the decision making process for individuals who are looking to start and scale their own spirits business?

Erin:
Yeah, I think. I think when you have initiative like farm warrant in place, it’s definitely opened up the thinking and just across the board, dia works very closely with discus, and they have relationships with every single supplier in the space and most of the distributors. And so how are we actually making it easier for black owned brands to launch? Is by having the conversations that, you know, we a need to reach some type of pro rata and representation, both on the founder side and product side, but, and also to internally in those buildings, and then create advocates for this program and initiative. So I think that us going out and really working with the community and spreading the notion that this is a position you could take in the spirits industry. This is how you could build your brand through the programming that we’re doing with HBCUs. I think all of that really creates a momentum and creates an energy where people are really thinking differently and are more willing to start a business in this space. And it doesn’t necessarily have to be the actual spirit. So we talk a lot about brands that kind of come in and create a business like a marketing agency that actually service is the spirit industry.

Erin:
So we talk a lot about, you know, investing in companies that don’t necessarily have to be the product, but it could be adjacent to the spirits industry. We just invested in an amazing platform called Event Noir. You know, they manage hundreds, if not thousands, of different black community events throughout the nation. And so all of those events need products, need brands. And so what is that intersection where we can use that platform to help promote our brands and to get our black founders more access to the consumers that they’re looking for? I think once you start really creating an ecosystem, push, all the possibilities open up. You have an industry that was guarded and probably not as open in the past, where you have us kind of advocating for that new approach, that new model, modern approach with it. With a black community.

Monique:
Yes.

Dia:
That was perfect.

Monique:
That was a perfect response. I love that you all have worked with a lot of brands, and from your experience, like, what would you tell a brand to, how would you say that they could stand out in this industry?

Dia:
I mean, part of it is the way you roll it out. I’m a big believer. And that narrow focus yields broad results. So instead of being like, I’m coming out with this vodka, and it’s going to be for everyone, what is, like, naturally part of your life? Right. So if you like. Well, I play tennis on Saturday. Okay, well, what’s a refreshing drink you would want to have? Maybe you want to have a lemon spritz right after that, then I would actually get real focused on, here are the other 100 communities that play tennis. But what I’ve noticed is nobody’s really talking to, like, black and brown women who play tennis any meaningful way.

Dia:
And it may feel counterintuitive to building a big business, but, like catagonia or Nike or Range Rover, they all started with being really specific on a very specific community, and they actually still don’t really change you still. People might drive their Range Rover, you know, me, to the grocery store, but you still can go straight up a mountain if you want. Right? You might go to Patagonia. You might just wear nikes to look fly. But. But the truth is that you really can run a marathon if you want to. So I think the idea of, well, making sure there’s some credibility, because you’re really going to be a lifelong founder owner. Ideally, it fits in with the truth of something you actually believe in and who you are.

Dia:
True communities are so important. Like, we talk a lot about social media, but real life social media, like, groups of humans still matter. You want to create a movement, being able to have, like, that kind of overlap and, like, intersection of conversation between everybody who loves something very specific. Those people are passionate about what they care about. There’s not going to be a better commercial than 1000 passionate people who love your brand, that’s a great place to start.

Monique:
That is so good. Love that. And so as people get into the industry and they’re continuing to scale or even thinking about scaling, what are some of the factors that they should consider in terms of, and I know you kind of touched on this earlier when it comes to production capacity, distribution channels and market expansion, like how do you mitigate that risk while you’re pursuing growth?

Erin:
One of the things that you kind of lose when you scale, which I think is really important for our founders and brands to think about, is really understanding as you gain distribution in the spirits industry, how are you speaking locally to those independent consumers? So, you know, a lot of brands to diaspoint that we’re competing with, their budgets are on a national, even an international scale. And the way that they use them could be for, you know, media, reach, press, etcetera, things that cost a ton of money. If you’re looking to scale, how are you speaking specifically on a localized way to feed the needs of that particular consumer? So a lot of times, you know, brands will start, I’m making this up, but like in a place like Atlanta, because they know that market, they understand the dynamic there. They have relationships, etcetera. But once you get, let’s say, more distribution and you move into DC or Tennessee and or another state, what are those specific needs? How is that consumer going to interact with your, with your product? What are the consumer trends that are happening there so that you’re not trying to overlay something that’s just general with a consumer that really needs a two way conversation that speaks directly to them. And so I think that’s one thing to really consider when you start to scale good stuff.

Monique:
And I want to know the role of relationships and, well, partnerships and collaborations and all of this. And how can entrepreneurs start to build and nurture those relationships when they’re going with distributors, retailers and all the other things?

Erin:
It’s so important. I want to give one example about a partnership that really helped us and work well on the lobo side. This is an example. We did a partnership with old El Paso. We work with them to execute our taco Tuesday and before our kind of taco Tuesday day was limited to our internal stakeholders and cap table, et cetera, which isn’t a bad thing because we have, you know, we had big talent like Dia said LeBron and Arnold and all these great athletes, et cetera. But where it really started to scale for us was when we created the partnership with old El Paso created some on and off premise programming that allowed us to touch different venues, different restaurants, different grocery stores, so on and so forth, and really helped us with our distribution and where we were already distributed, gave us another set of eyeballs, if you will, associated with a pretty much big brand, a big brand, if you will. And so I think when you think about partnerships, they really can help accelerate your brand and you could really borrow equity from them as well as, you know, marketing dollars or marketing platforms and or reach. So I think that’s a great way to get more scalable and not spend as much marketing dollars as you would if you were to do it all by yourself.

Monique:
And so we always like to think about some of the challenges that come with any business, specifically in this industry. In your experience, what are some of the common pitfalls or challenges that you see entrepreneurs face? And some of the advice that you can give our audience, I mean, I.

Dia:
Would say the first important piece here is just managing your timeline. So you’re launching a different business, you can put together a direct to consumer, you could get a great website, you could be powered by Shopify, and you could be good to go. You could actually start, you know, many businesses pretty quickly, more than you could like 20 years ago with the power of tech. The spirits industry still does not move like that, right. So you have got to build in a lot of time. And you also have to realize that you are selling to, you really have two sets of customers, really three sets. You need to sell to your distributor. They need to believe in it.

Dia:
They have to understand because they are the only one that’s going to be able to sell to the restaurants and liquor stores, right. And so forth. And the restaurants, the liquor stores, they also have to believe in your brand and understand it and make sure it has the right shelf placement and know what it even is if somebody comes and asks about it. And then you also have to be driving the consumer, right. So at any given time you’re managing a push. If the product in pull, have the consumer take the product out and many people can come into the industry and treat it like another brand of like, oh, I’m selling lipstick. My lipstick is popping. I got a great video.

Dia:
I’m pushing it out. I put it up is DTC. It’s lipstick.com. order today. This requires more coordination, but it also can be yield you really high margins of profitability for that extra work.

Monique:
So good. So good. So what I love about the work that you all are doing is the fact that you are really empowering entrepreneurs through education and resources. And I love that. And that’s something that we are very passionate about here at black to business. So I want to talk about some of the initiatives or platforms that support black entrepreneurs in this industry and how effective they are in leveling the playing field and even just talking about some of the things that procorn offers to support.

Dia:
Yeah. So pronghorn is offering a variety of things. And to your point, it’s, one, is cash investing real dollars into entrepreneurs. But then we also have some kind of shark tank type of activities that we do with HBCUs, where we also will invest or reward great concentrations, great ideas. The education piece, though, is often told back to us, and I really feel is actually more important than the dollar. So we have Erin mentioned earlier an organization called Discus, that’s the leading trade organization for suppliers. And suppliers are like Bacardi, Moe Hennessy, Diageo. Shout to Diageo.

Dia:
As they were our anchor investor and also our strategic partner. We were building Ciroc vodka. So those companies, right. Have one, they have agreed, we didn’t say this earlier, have agreed to their commitment for hiring black Americans from intern to c suite at their organization. One, two, they are sharing their knowledge, their resources and information with our founders. Three, your organization called Discus, did a lot of work together with cornell many years ago and have just like, a robust curriculum of like, okay, I want to be in the. I want to be in the industry, but I don’t know every single thing there is to know about whiskey, right? Somebody you can go and learn about rise versus bourbon. What does it mean to be a Tennessee whiskey? What does it mean to be scotch versus japanese whiskey?

Erin:
Right.

Dia:
You can’t really learn. The other thing we love about the reason why we’re like, everybody come in this industry is it’s actually just a fun industry. Right? Like, you’re in the hospitality industry. We’re all working really hard, but it’s nice to be someplace where, like, I, like, I love knowing a little bit about a good tequila. We have a library of information that can. That you can learn from, to your point, around other organizations. A woman named Melissa runs an organization called the 1863 Ventures out of Washington, DC. She does an outstanding job of helping founders be ready to raise capital.

Dia:
Right. So here’s what you need. The deck, the presentation, what you say in a room. How are you putting together your case for your brand concept? So I think that’s also critically important and a nice compliment to the work that we do. And I will also spotlight another organization called Women of Divine and Spirits, where they have put together something that helps focus on the retail side. So essentially, if you are interested in supporting a woman owned brand or black owned brand, you don’t want to wait till Black History Month to do it. Same way you can see a little tag that says this brand is kosher, right? Or this brand is having GMO’s. She has worked with regulators to say, this brand is diverse powered.

Dia:
This brand is women powered. Right? So our brands have a chance to be on a target shelf with the designation of being diverse powered for consumers, particularly Gen Z consumers who are like, oh, you know, I want to support these type of brands all year round. We talk a lot about, you know, a lot of civil rights you can do with just your regular daily activity. Look at your pantry, look in your refrigerator, look in your toiletry closet, right? Are your brand, are they 50% women owned? Are they, you know, 14% to 50% black owned? That’s a change you can make. You don’t have to go to one parade, go about it, right? So she has an organization in the platform that drives that forward. And then I, you know, I will definitely say this over and over again, we are looking every day for incredible talent. It doesn’t matter. You don’t have to actually drink to be in this industry.

Dia:
There are accountants, there are janitorial services, there are marketers, there are CEO’s, there are ad agencies, there are lawyers. Right? There’s a ton of things that you could do in any other industry that you can do in our industry. One of the biggest impediments is it just doesn’t really occur to people. I know. I can tell you, I never, when I was, I’m 48, but when I was 24, it never occurred to me that, like, oh, wait, hundreds of people work on Johnny Walker or like, you know, me, or like, thousands of people work a job option on Pronghorn Co. Today we have a thousand jobs open in the spirits industry, of which the mean average pay in this industry is $100,000. And that person affects typically, what, $1.2 million of top line revenue. So bringing great talent into the industry is good for the community and good for the industry.

Monique:
Yes, I am round up. I love it. And that’s why I was so happy to have this conversation, because I’m like, even I wasn’t thinking. So I’m intrigued and I’m so glad that we had you both here. And I want to ask, how can people connect and get that guidance? So what does it look like? Process to work with Procorn.

Dia:
Yes. So, yes, you can start with Pronghorn Co. That’s co dot co. And if you have an idea, if you want to be an entrepreneur, own your own brand. It’s not too early. You can reach out to us if you’re interested in working in the industry. But you were like, well, before I apply to something, what do I need to know? Please drop us a line if you already have a brand. Of course we’re interested.

Dia:
And as Erin said, if you’re, if you have something that could be a, adjacent to the industry, for example, the labels you see on many bottles. Right? Like, we’re looking for more black owned vendors that could produce labels. As a simple example, if you have expertise in digital content, these brands are looking for more culturally forward content creators. Right? So Crowdborn co serves really to help bridge the gap and bring people into the industry who are doing us a favor to help us meet our objectives. By reaching out with your ideas and your interests that we can successfully hit our mission of $2.4 billion of economic value.

Monique:
Love that. And DEA. Can you talk about the curriculum with the incubator and the accelerator program?

Dia:
Yes. So essentially the accelerated type program is this. And that’s what we refer to supercharging. That’s really what it means by acceleration. Right. So if we are assessing, we find the great brand is, you know, it’s Monique’s margaritas. And then we are talking through, typically we will invest both cash and hours of support. So if you, if you were to go to a consultancy company, a big company like Bain or McKinsey, right.

Dia:
And they, you know, they charge a few thousand dollars an hour. Right. You’re getting that type of expertise from this team. So we would say, okay, we’re interested, depending on what level, we’re cutting checks anywhere from twenty five thousand dollars to one point five million dollars, depending on where the brand is, and then on top of that, we’ll say we’re going to work with you on a custom plan for your brand. Seems like you have a dope idea, but you’re spending a lot of money on glass. We want to help you with your supply piece. It looks like you have great creative as an example, but we want to help you with your sales plan. I was on a supercharging session earlier this week, and it gets really in the nitty gritty of like, we think you should be these 500 accounts and we think your salespeople should go to these 80 accounts twice a week and you should be selling one bottle per one of these accounts every six weeks.

Dia:
And in order to do that, we suggest you need this kind of point of sale and messaging along with human touch points of going in and out. And we saw your p and L, but we’ve compared it to 20 other brands just like yours. We recommend you look at these adjustments and we really act like an extended part of that brand’s team to help maximize efficiencies, because we want to be swimming in success. We want to give these brands and give us all of that opportunity information as quickly as possible to truly accelerate them. And the reality is there’s such a gap. We’re not coming from zero, we’re coming from like negative 50,000. Right. So we’re trying to do what we could do to be, not just at baseline, to make sure you have a bolster, to just, just kill it and be successful in this industry.

Dia:
The other small thing is not really small. The other thing is the industry is filled with these incredible huge companies who for them, they may be like, oh, this brand is disaster. It only made $25 million. But our view is like, let us take those deals. Let a founder and a family say like, oh, I have a wonderful life for me and my children and my grandchildren running this business, and I could build a legacy for my family that it actually means a lot for me in my community to have this kind of dollars where it’s not these big companies. So we have a space that we can live in, help grow the industry and also grow community together.

Monique:
That is so amazing. I mean, that Monique’s margarita has a nice ring to it. I’m going to, yeah, I love that. And just the process. I love it. I think it’s so necessary. So did somebody has listened, black entrepreneurs listening, and they are thinking, I don’t know if this is for me. I’ve been thinking about it for a while.

Monique:
What advice would you give them to go ahead and get started.

Dia:
I would say, you know, click on, come on, go check out Farhorn Co. Go walk around the restaurant and see what there is. And then also, again, it doesn’t have to be in spirits. We’re invested in a company called Hella and they are more in the bidder space. Right. Which is very specific. There are things in mixer space. There are things that are, like, adjacent to spirits.

Dia:
But like, look at my thing is always just like, look, life is short, right? So what is something that makes you happy? It brings you joy to do. The idea of being a part of the spirits industry is more just because it’s an untapped opportunity. Right. So you could go, you know, many of many people, unfortunately, we’re all fighting for the same dream of like, well, I have a great idea I want to do with the NBA, or I have a great idea I want to do a fox search light. It’s just like, well, you could take that same idea and flourish in a space where you are largely absent. Right. And get the money unlocks a lot of freedom. So where’s the opportunity for you to take your passion and bring it into an industry that’s underserved and actually desirous to see it like this is, you know, I have to give credit to this industry.

Dia:
I don’t think every, some other industries would have been more resistant. We really do have the support, like, you know, financially and hearts of this program. So when we talk about these companies and William Grants, the Edringtons and Moe Hennessy, the diagnosis of the world, they are actively saying, yeah, we want to do this. Help introduce us, you know, you know, we have a chance where there’s a real warm welcome. So I recommend working into that.

Monique:
Yes, certainly. Well, dear, you have had a phenomenal career and you are doing such amazing things, like looking back, like what has been in your journey. The best risk that you’ve taken.

Dia:
The best risk.

Monique:
Mm hmm.

Dia:
You know, I would say, let me think about that. I would say. So I started, I think it just being more entrepreneurial in general. So this was not really, it wasn’t really a point of conversation. When I was growing up, you, when I was growing up, it was like, you know, you could, you could just get a job. You know, I live in new york. You took the city test or maybe even really work hard. You could be a lawyer or a doctor.

Dia:
But the idea of, like, starting your own business wasn’t really on my radar. When I worked for park barnes, we mentioned earlier, washington, dc, I started to do the math one day of just like, okay, hold up. We selling this many cocktails. We are letting this many people in. It’s how much it costs, how much you’re paying for restaurants and just doing some rough math. I was like, oh, this place, this small, lovely, like, basically extended restaurant is making millions of year. And it was just a real, aha. Moment of like, hello.

Dia:
I could just think of risk has been a choice to, like, be entrepreneurial, figure out how to raise capital and build businesses that we have real ownership in. This is, this is how you kind of de risk risk and how I do the, in the US, the average white american is worth 13 times what the average black american is. But if you double click and just pull out owners of something that multiple drops to three x. So even today, standing on centuries of inequity, if you own something, a stock portfolio, a nail salon with your homies, you know, I mean like a house, Airbnb, you are. We are already figured out a way to address some of the gaping inequities. Right. So for me, you know, and. Sorry.

Dia:
And the double double click is of that sub black Americans who own anything are on average worth twelve times what black Americans who own nothing. So we talk about the, it’s perceived as a big risk to figure out something you can own yourself, but it is not mathematically true show. It’s not.

Monique:
Right.

Dia:
So what you would say is the risk of me being like, whoa, it was going on on my own to do my own thing is actually a much faster pathway to wealth generation.

Monique:
Yes. Perspective. I love that. And so as an owner, business owner in this journey, what have been some of the favorite tools or resources that have really helped you in this journey?

Dia:
I mean, so what is the two biggest tools from a, from a building awareness around your brand are really around like, you know, communications and, and really online social media, right? Like, we’re not. So to this day, we don’t have budgets to run Super bowl commercials and things like that. But the way you can access local press, the truth is actually, you know, everybody lives somewhere local. But going on the Demopolis morning News in Alabama typically will sell more than a big feature on a big national show because people are like, oh, they write in my makes a difference. So I think people don’t underestimate the power of like local blogs, the local little, and don’t, you know, don’t laugh. But even still a Facebook group occasionally, those people really being laser focused on, don’t just be on IG post like crazy. Go and find the like, okay, my brand, it has a bear on the front. So I’m going to the top 100 bear enthusiast pages and they may only have 70 each.

Dia:
But like, that kind of local focus, I think is so local and specific has been a real tool and unlock sound advice.

Monique:
And my final question is, what does it mean to you to be black in business?

Dia:
I mean, I love it. Even with all of his challenges, even with all of the challenges that are such a waste of everybody’s time, right? So I’m not going to like, I walk into a room still and there is not for me, but there may be confusion from the room about value, right? And then we got a waste of time of you getting up to speed on like, I’m gonna make everybody better in this room. Right? So I kind of delight, though, in witnessing that transition, although I hope so dearly that my eleven year old will not have to experience that when she is of age. And the business room, I think we are at a, you know, we’ve seen this crazy rise of the DEI conversation and then violent and precipitous drop because people have confused Dei with some sort of charitable extra thing to do that is unfair when it is in fact, and this, and I am borrowing this term, this is not mine, but in fact, it really is America’s business plan. And it’s not about a game of musical chairs, it’s about building a bigger table. Right? And as we grow this country that I love, and I have a right to be here and a right to fully participate in the financial upside of the opportunity here. My success at every black american who is, you know, who is making it go in business is better for them and better for the black community, but it is better for the country at large. And that appears to be what has been the gap that we all have to continue to, to rally and push forward.

Monique:
Such a powerful answer. This has been such a powerful conversation. Thank you to you and Erin both for being on the show and just spreading light to the industry and knowledge and doing the work that you are doing. And thank you so much for being on the show. And I know people are going to want to know how can they connect with you all support. So please do share.

Dia:
Yes, thank you so much. Well, listen, we are my, I’m just my name which is Sims and then our IG on Farmhorn is just. And Erin is still boycotting Instagram. So if you said prom horn a note, she will make sure we’ll make sure she gets it.

Monique:
Yes, I would be sure to put all of these things in the show notes so people can connect again, thank you both for being on the show and thank you so much for what you are doing.

Monique:
This episode has been nothing short of inspiring as we delve deep into the world of black entrepreneurship and the spirits industry with our incredible guests, dia and Erin. They shared the mission of Pronghorn. Please forgive me for not pronouncing that end throughout the entire conversation. Such a cringe moment. However, they also discussed their dedication to driving 2.4 billion in economic value, the significance of addressing economic disparities, and once again ignited the potential that resides within our community. We are truly powerful. We also explored the myriad of opportunities in the spirits industry, emphasizing that need for culturally forward content, innovative spirits brands, and the importance of local engagement and brand building. They also highlighted this accelerated program known as superchargers and the immense value of cash investments and bespoke expertise that pronghorn offers.

Monique:
And remember, you are not alone in this journey. There is a whole world of resources and support out there ready to help you succeed. So thank you so much for being a valued listener and a cherished part of the black to business family. We truly appreciate you. And to learn more about Dia, Eren and Pronghorn, as well as the powerful resources that they mentioned, head over to blacktobusiness.com 20 one and we can’t wait to have you back here next week. Same time, same place. But until then, take care and keep pushing the culture forward.